Forging a Stake Anvil

[Gene C]

Forging a Celtic Spearhead IMPROVED VERSION

http://blacksmith.org/forums/media.php?do=details&mid=68

Nice forging demo, my thoughts, dang thats a short handled hammer.

[Grant]

Trying to talk Newman into making those anvils. I think the re-enactors would go bonkers for them.

[JNewman]

I have to pick up a lump of steel next week and I think I will forge a couple in the new year, see if anyone wants one.

[Grant]

So, ya got some ideas on dimensions? Process? Ya gonna make a bolster? I don't think you'll get much hardness from 1045 in this size. Even 4140 is marginal. I'd probably get 4340.

How big ya gonna make the spike/shank? I was thinking that I'd butcher and draw the shank first, then drop it in a bolster and use a gradiant heat and a thin flat bar to upset the top. Might be able to reverse the order to avoid the need of a bolster.

[JNewman]

I thought that one looked to be about 3" at the base and 4 at the top. But I did the math and one made from 4" would work out to about 40lb which seems to be a minimum to me, although the shape of that anvil uses the weight more efficiently than a london pattern. I emailed EMJ for stock availability and my local outlet does not have 4" square 4140 and actually declined to quote a full length. I did find a local place that has some but they are awfully proud of that. I have some 4"x2.5" 4140 flat bar on the shelf so I think I will just upset a piece or two of that. I just bought 25' of 2.75" 4340 but it would take too much upsetting to use that.

I was thinking of making a bolster with about a 1.25"-1.5" hole. Butchering the shank, drawing it out and tapering it. I would probably have to cut a little material of the shank because of how long the minimum I could bite off would draw out to. Then upset the top using the bolster, I had forgotten about using a flat bar/fuller and had just planned to let the bolster cool the bottom and use light blows so that the top upsets rather than barrelling it. But using a flat bar makes far more sense. I will then use a large radius spring fuller to chamfer the corners. Heat treat it and then either machine the top or sand it on my smaller disk sander (24" 40grit).

I think it's worth using a bolster to get a cleaner face on the bottom.

[Grant]

Sure, it doesn't have to be square. I'd be tempted to make the shank tapered from 2" square down to 1" and about 5" long. Yeah, the end will come out a little ass-holed and folded, but so what? It's just going down in the stump! Nobody will ever see it again.

I think I would upset it down, pull it out and square it up and then finish it in the bolster a little. Leave the corners pretty sharp, up to the smith to decide there.

Really be fun to make them out of mild and forge weld a steel top on. Way too much work there though.

Yeah, 50 pounds is probably all ya want to handle. I'd be sorely tempted to re-heat the face while it's still hot and set it face down on an aluminum block to heat treat it. I'd make the block with some holes through it and plumb water through. If I had a shop press I'd even press it down tight and leave it to cool. That would work good on 4340 maybe even 4140. Give it a little draw and finish it.

I suppose with cooling running through it, a steel block might work good too. They actually make a machine called a "quench press". be good to grind all the scale off just before the finishing blows.

I love forging things in my head. Walking through every step in detail.

[Grant]

Bet there would be a market with knife makers for this too. I'd be tempted to fill a 5 gallon bucket with concrete and plop it into. Bet that would work great.

Put it in a stump for portable and in concrete for a shop anvil.

Ought to get $250 for a 50 pounder, huh?

[JNewman]

Ought to get $250 for a 50 pounder, huh?

I would hope so.

If it was just going in my shop I wouldn't worry too much about the end of the shank but selling I would want them somewhat pretty. The corners I was talking about chamfering were the vertical corners not the ones on the face, you think they should be sharp too? The one advantage of forging the shank first is it would be easier to hold with tongs without the flared top. Why would you upset first? If I were making the shank that long I would probably clean up the bottom edge in the bolster before tapering the shank so the bolster doesn't have to be that high.

As you say making them from mild and welding a face on them would be neat to try but would take too long but it may be fun to try once. I do have a piece of mild steel 3.5" square 9" long that would work well for that. The smaller piece would be easier to handle with the forge weld.

[Grant]

Shanking first would certainly be the prefered way. I was just trying to find a way to make a one-off without making tooling. Although I can picture starting it in a pyramid bottom depression or even a "V" block. This would get some upsetting done and make a better end for butchering the shank.

"If I were making the shank that long I would probably clean up the bottom edge in the bolster before tapering the shank so the bolster doesn't have to be that high". Good idea! I wouldn't have worried about that in any of my bigger hammers, like my 700 Bell. Actually, my bell had 1-1/2" square hole in one end of the bottom die, so I just would have slid it over a bit and used that for my bolster.

Well planned is half way there.

[Grant]

When shanking something like this it's often better not to butcher all the way around right off. Butcher two opposite sides then stomp it a couple blows to bulge the end, then butcher the other two sides and forge down.