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8:53 pm
August 29, 2010
Offline
I’m not sure this is the right section but there is no tool thread in the bladesmithing section, I can’t think of use a blacksmith would make of this tool, other than sharpening tools and such. Anyway I decided to take up knife making a few weeks ago. Got held up thinking about heat treating and decided to build a gas forge. This little break gave me adequate time to get into mischief so I thought I would try my hand at fancy edge filing like the pros do. When I realized I couldn’t hold the knife in a more comfortable position than stuck in my post vice, I was ecstatic, I had a tool excuse, so I went looking on the net for how the pros did it, they didn’t have much, and what is available is high priced so I started on my own design and I came up with this:
[Image Can Not Be Found]
[Image Can Not Be Found]
This is the prototype and its rough, but I’m proud of the design and wanted to show it off as soon as I got the application number. The only blacksmith work on it is the ball and socket, but it is what shines the brightest in my eyes. I shaped the retainer and used a mig to weld the ears on, I know it could be all forged but it got a bit tricky hand forging with the inside angle, and I’m not Brian Brazeal, I’ll need to make a swage or two, I’m hoping to figure out a way to get a press. I think if you’re a knife maker you can find just the position you want with this. The design allows the vice to tilt over 90 degrees and twist and spin to any position. It uses a 2 3/8” ball and socket for positioning and locking, it is very strong. The vice is 3” EMT ‘galvanized’ pipe but it was what I had on hand. I designed it large enough to hold a slab of steel to back a blade for hand filing and sanding. The angle base can sit in a vice or be mounted to the side of a bench, the base of the tool can be mounted to a bench top or clamped to a drill press or other machine. When I get the proper parts and one prettied up I’m going to try to sell them in the knife forums. So what do you guys think?
it's been fun, later!
10:47 pm
April 21, 2010
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Well Bob I like the way I do it better really. I will have to get some pictures of it to put up for you. I have one (actually three of them in the shop) of the chinese vises that swivel. I have one next to my desk where I do most of my knife work except forging. I use a combination of that vise and a couple of other pieces I use with it for my blade work. I just finished file working 18 of them a couple of weeks ago. By the time I finished those I was sick of file work. Will get some pics for you tomorrow.
The best and the right way of doing things is what works for you in your shop!
12:29 am
September 3, 2010
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Robert Suter
"I started on my own design and I came up with this"
David Nighswander
I like the ball and socket concept. I've seen several with fixed mounts that don't have the flexibility that your design has. Can the tube rotate in the mounting ring?
Just a tweak suggestion. Could you bore a hole in a plate as a clamp rather than the two separate sections? Seems a little easier to build and sturdier also.
1:41 am
August 29, 2010
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David,
Thanks, I am most proud of the ball and socket, it works a treat. Yes, the tube spins in the ring, it tightens with a bolt in brackets as you would expect, I need to procure some fancy knobs. I suppose I should have taken more pictures, but the sun was hot. The part mounted in the vice is a 7” section of 4” angle iron, and if I understand what you describe it that is how it was first designed. I redesigned after considering the need to drill straight handle pin holes in tapered tangs, by clamping it or bolting to a drill press it will make that a little easier I believe. I added the plate by using 3/8 bolts in the corners and tapping the angle iron its plenty strong. I also thought some people might want to mount it on their bench or some other way, so I didn’t want them to be forced to buy the vice mount if they didn’t want it. Thanks for the suggestion and if I misunderstood you, please rephrase it, I can be incredibly dense at times.
Bob
it's been fun, later!
3:22 am
September 3, 2010
Offline
I am by no means being critical of your efforts. I only suggest what I think could be improvements to your design.
A picture would be much better but I'll try using less than a thousand words.
I was refering to the clamping ring that you forged. If you intend to sell the vise I was thinking rather than forging the clamping ring you could bore a hole in a plate and reduce your manufacturing costs.
More rambling:
It appears that you are using the large nut on the bottom as the method to apply clamping force to the ball. Once again in an attempt to simplify, by using your 3/8"? bolts as the clamping method the design could be further simplified. Allow one side to float on the bolt. (leave the double nuts with a .030 gap between the bottom nut and the clamp ring) and use the other bolt as the clamping mechanism. The clamp ring will not require much travel from "full clamp" to "free to move". Afixing one side of the clamp ring in a hinge type mount would reduce the number of parts also. If this method is used a 1/2 Acme thread instead of the 3/8" bolt will improve the life of the clamping device. Alternately a cam could be used instead of the thread to make the device more robust.
Lastly, having the gap in the clamping ring allows the vise to be rotated from vertical to 90 degrees. This is a nice feature. By setting the ball and socket at a 45 degree angle, in relation to the floor, the ball will still be able to move from the vertical to the 90 degree position, without the weakening caused by the notch.
4:41 am
August 29, 2010
Offline
David,
I am never offended by critical analysis or opinion, and a suggestion in my mind is an offer to help. I see what you mean now and that will work I have tested the retainer by bolting it and forcing the ball onto a flat plate it works great holds incredibly strong. The large nut is mounted to a treaded rod that is welded in place it provides progressive friction that allows easy movement to the desired position and prevents it from flopping around without a spring. I intend to shorten it and may just use a plain round nut. The nuts on the ears are ½ “ and believe me it is extremely robust. The retainer is very versatile in my specification I have form one to four mounting point positions in five different configurations what your describing would be very adaptable to the three point mount. Like this:
You could use the point at the top to lock the ball. There are more ways to clamp the ball into the retainer than you can shake a stick at. Setting the retainer at a 45 degree angle would work fine but there is nothing weak about the retainer. You sound like a guy with ideas, would you like to begin negotiations for a manufacturing license?;)
Bob
it's been fun, later!
7:05 am
NWBA Member
August 8, 2010
Offline
Robert, where are you with this vise?
Dave
No one really listens to anyone else, and if you try it for a while you'll see why.
- Mignon McLaughlin
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